wrestling / Columns
411 Fact or Fiction Wrestling: Ziggler as a Main Event Star, Rollins Surpassing Reigns, More
Welcome back to the latest edition of 411 Fact or Fiction, Wrestling Edition! Stuff happened, people loved/hated it and let everyone else know. I pick through the interesting/not so interesting tidbits and then make 411 staff members discuss them for your pleasure. Battling this week: First up is the one and only Nick Marsico! He battles Wyatt Beougher AND Jack Bramma!
1. While WWE has designs on making Roman Reigns the next guy in the company, Seth Rollins will continue his string of impressive performances and be the one to really break out in 2015.
Wyatt Beougher: FACT – Prior to 2014, I probably would have said “Fiction”, just for the simple fact that the WWE has always done a very good job of making sure the people that they wanted at the top of the card ended up at the top of the card (Cena for the last decade, in spite of Punk’s popularity, and Triple H for several years before that, in spite of popular support for Jericho and Booker T, among others), but the “Yes Movement” earlier this year showed me that if a wrestler can get enough popular support behind them, there is at least a chance that they will be elevated to where they belong on the card. Of course, Daniel Bryan is back cleaning floors and waiting for the glass slipper to arrive in his particular Cinderella story, and there is a significantly lower chance that the heel Rollins will be able to inspire the same fervor in the average, lowest common denominator WWE crowd, but as long as that chance exists, I am choosing to be optimistic. Being in the crowd at TLC(S) and seeing the reaction that Reigns got from the live audience (a relatively terrible audience compared to that of the 2014 Royal Rumble), I am not in the camp that thinks that the average blue collar WWE fan is going to turn on Reigns, but I am holding out hope that somewhere along the way, both Ambrose and Rollins get their due. While it is a point of some contention that both of the other former members of the Shield are more talented than Reigns, I feel like even Reigns’ staunchest supporters have to admit that he is not as ready for the main event at this moment in time as either Rollins or Ambrose. And that is not to say that Reigns will not go on to have the best career of the three, just that right now, as we approach 2015, both Ambrose and Rollins are more capable of working singles matches from start to finish and both seem more competent on the microphone. Personally, I think Reigns will get there (and he is infinitely further along than his cousins, the Usos), but he just is not there, yet.
Jack Bramma: FICTION – Questions like this are the reason that I didn’t do too well with true/false tests in school. Will Seth Rollins continue his strong of impressive performances? Yes. Will he be the one to break out in 2015? No, he already broke out in 2014. Will he break out even more in 2015? No and for a couple of reasons: booking and match layout. Rollins had a killer 2014 with dynamite performances in MITB, HITC, Survivor Series, and yes, even TLC(S). But in every match, he’s looked a clear level beneath the face he’s working against, especially Cena in the fall and winter. The tables match and the cage match against Cena, along with Cena’s cage match against Bray at EE, were some of the most egregiously overbooked and counterproductive matches all year. It’s the same way Miz was made to look as champ and Swagger and pretty much every heel who ever cashed in and won the strap via the MITB which is fitting considering that’s exactly where we are headed with Rollins. He cashes in at the end of RR on the winner of Cena/Brock, wins the belt, and goes on to face RR winner Roman Reigns in the final Shield blowoff at Mania and of course loses in glorious fashion. Inevitably, Seth will have the same booking that Miz had going into Mania 27 and Jericho had going into Mania XVII – an afterthought and mostly a joke. Put another way, Seth’s star might rise and he’ll continue to have great matches, but he’ll continue as a sniffling heel and might get jobbed out of Mania in such dominant fashion that it neuters him as a main event player for a while.
Nick Marsico: FACT – It’s hard to keep a guy down when you’ve already pushed him as hard as WWE has pushed Seth Rollins. Well, when you have pushed a guy that hard, he has the talent, AND he has delivered every single time the ball has been handed to him. I think WWE is going to find out the hard way that if Roman Reigns doesn’t start upping his game in a big way that the audience doesn’t want a guy who can’t perform up to their high standards. If Roman keeps stumbling over his lines (I hope he gets a refund from that acting coach) and can’t put together cohesive matches longer than 6 or 7 minutes (the match with Orton at SummerSlam was pretty good, to be fair) then we could see their rash decision to push him when he isn’t ready blow up in their faces. Yes, it’s good to listen to the fans and give somebody who they are responding to a chance, but that was just a lucky coincidence since Roman was always pegged to be the guy who would leave The Shield and be jumped right up to the big time. Rollins has been unbelievable since his singles run started and as much as I always loved him, I really didn’t think he would get this kind of shot and actually deliver at this incredibly high level. It makes me proud to say I’ve been following his career for about a decade. Long story short, Rollins has been far exceeding the expectations of probably everybody — Reigns is going to do well for himself but may hit a brick wall if he doesn’t overcome his limitations. Rollins has become very strong in the area of promos and when his body stops working properly enough for him to be a crazy high-flyer he has the ability to work a more grounded style that will give him longevity. Rollins is well on his way to being the complete package. Reigns has a very strong box and the right packing tape, but they’re going to try to tape the box shut before putting everything inside and a pretty little bow on top isn’t going to make the recipients happy when it comes time to open it up on Christmas morning. That was a damn good metaphor.
2. Dolph Ziggler will finally be treated like a main event player in 2015.
Wyatt Beougher: FACT – Again, I am erring on the side of optimism here, because as the new year approaches, with so much quality wrestling programming available, including true alternatives to the WWE like NXT, Lucha Underground, and NJPW (through their on-demand online deal and a deal with AXS TV, as well as their partnership with GFW), the WWE is going to be facing more competition than they have seen in years, and if they do not start listening to their fans, it could be extremely damaging to their ratings and the WWE Network’s subscriber base. More than that, Ziggler had the most memorable performances of any Superstar at both Survivor Series and TLC(S), giving him a ton of momentum going into the new calendar year. Sure, people are still talking about Sting (which is why I still feel that was a terrible booking decision) and the idiotic ending to the TLC(S) main event, but they are also talking about Ziggler. How he was able to play the Cena role at Survivor Series and overcome impossible odds to win the match for his team, and also how he busted his ass in his hometown and stole the show (with an assist from Luke Harper, of course). For as many things as WWE has done wrong since the end of “WrestleMania season” (and there are a litany of mistakes, believe me), their booking of Ziggler on pay-per-views the past two-plus months has been outstanding. As I said in my response to the first statement, Daniel Bryan has shown us that if a performer can capture the zeitgeist of the live crowds and merchandise-buying public, he or she actually has a chance to be elevated. And while I am concerned that Rollins may not be able to do that as a heel, the reactions that Ziggler continues to get would almost certainly position him in that Daniel Bryan position as the calendar rolls over into 2015. Perhaps ironically, the biggest threat to derail Dolph’s push is Bryan himself, but that is another topic for another time, and with Bryan still apparently not cleared to return, I am sticking with my initial reaction of calling this one a FACT.
Jack Bramma: FICTION – Another of the above. Will Dolph be treated like a main event player in 2015? Yes. Is this the first time he’s been treated like a main event player? Of course not. He was one of the main attractions in 2012 – winning the MITB, captaining the main SS team (when Cena was injured), and then beating Cena in a ladder match to retain his briefcase at TLC (with AJ’s help). He carried that momentum into 2013 where he cashed in and beat ADR in one of the best moments of the year and then had one of the best matches of the year at Payback that year, also against ADR. He also previously challenged for world championships against Punk and Edge in main events. There’s a ton of mitigating factors in the above, but the basic point remains: that Dolph has been a main event player before 2015. I think the big question though, is will Dolph be treated like a main event face in 2015? Will he be one of the RR final four? If there’s an EC at Fast Lane, will Dolph be involved and will he get a pinfall or two? If there’s not, will he challenge for the belt at Fast Lane, possibly against a heel Rollins? Will Dolph win the Andre the Giant Memorial Battle Royal at WM31 if they have another one? Will he get main event programs or will he get lost in the shuffle behind Cena/Ambrose/Wyatt/Rollins/Reigns/DB/Ryback/Brock/Orton? Unfortunately, I think the answer to most is no and even if it’s a yes, like Cesaro in 2013, Dolph could still get lost in the shuffle by the end of the year.
Nick Marsico: FACT – I have no clue what changed, but nearly overnight the man went from persona non grata to the first Intercontinental Champion to be booked strong in who knows how long. He has been winning matches, his losses matter because they are setting up wins in more important matches and he was given the majority of the spotlight in the most important game changing PPV main events in a long time. Will the booking continue into the New Year? I certainly hope so, because he has been proving time and time again that he has the ability to work as a face and a heel at a very high level and can hang with everyone in the company from the top to the bottom of the card and all the way back up. I’m wary to get too excited about this until he has been in a good position for a longer period of time, but he hasn’t had his legs cut out from underneath him yet. I’m willing to state outright that barring another injury that puts him out of action, Ziggler may get a sniff of the WWE World Heavyweight Championship before this time next year. He might not win it, but he will be considered a legitimate threat.
3. You are optimistic about TNA’s new deal with Destination America following the announcement of additional programming.
Wyatt Beougher: FICTION – While I am optimistic about TNA’s new deal with Destination America, it has little to do with the announcement of their additional programming. A two-hour recap show with different camera angles the morning/afternoon after Impact airs? A greatest matches anthology series? While anything that increases TNA’s awareness in the eyes of the Destination America audience is almost certainly a good thing, until they announce British Boot Camp and/or an American version of that show is going to be airing on Destination America, I will remain unfazed by the announcement of additional programming. Instead, I will choose to excited about the other changes that TNA has announced thus far, like the fact that Mike Tenay is relegated to the aforementioned Saturdayrecap show, rather than continuing to drag down Impact broadcasts. Now if they would just replace Tazz and his myriad of unprofessionalisms (misogyny and homophobia foremost among them), it would be significantly easier to watch an episode of Impact without being frustrated by the commentators. Another positive is the fact that Destination America considers TNA to be a priority and that they are willing to promote the company to the best of their ability. This is a huge upgrade over SpikeTV, who always seemed to be hoping that they could lure the WWE back. As Lucha Underground has shown (and as I wrote about before LU even debuted), that kind of network synergy is crucial to a wrestling company debuting on a new network, and it appears as though TNA will now have that in spades. That, combined with the fact that TNA is apparently looking to update everything about their presentation – logos, commentary team, etc, is far more exciting than recap and “Best of” shows.
Jack Bramma: FICTION – Good for TNA, but I feel the same way as I do about ROH and Lucha Underground, even if the product is great, the channel is hard to find on the dial.
Nick Marsico: FACT – The network appears to have put a lot of faith in TNA to deliver quality programming. I’m pretty far behind on TNA, as I was strongly disappointed by the first run of shows taped at the Manhattan Center and tuned out after only seeing a couple of the Impact episodes from there. Maybe it was just built up too much, but bringing back the old ECW guys for the 900th time was not what I was hoping for or expecting. I can’t stand the Dixie Carter heel character (in a bad way) and having to watch her AND the ECW guys on a series of over hyped shows was a death knell for the promotion to me. I have read a lot of good things about some of the other things that have happened at subsequent NYC tapings (Team 3D/Hardys/Wolves series for one) and I’m glad Bobby Roode didn’t end up getting stuck in the very large club of one-time only World Champions. Destination America is going to apparently be 24 hours of TNA, so surely something they put out there is going to stick and be entertaining. Truthfully, though, some of the ideas sound promising and if they are going to do an overhaul that will probably guarantee us at least a few weeks of strong shows before they fall right back into the same traps in the booking room that they have been for the past 12 years. I am ready to go into this with an open mind just like I always do when TNA says they are starting over. It’s pro wrestling; I have been burned a thousand times by a thousand companies but I’ll always keep coming back because I love it. The fact that TNA employs a very good group of wrestlers also doesn’t hurt.
SWITCH!
4. Based on what you have seen from both, Adrian Neville has more main roster potential than Sami Zayn.
Nick Marsico: FICTION – I think Neville is amazing. I’m probably one of the few people who likes his new name more than his indy name and he has developed into a very, very strong and well-rounded in-ring performer. Not that he wasn’t there before coming to NXT, but he’s noticeably better now than he was before being signed by WWE and it is just awesome to see. That said, Zayn was already completely well rounded while working on the independent scene (the now retired pro wrestler, his cousin El Generico, taught him well) and his ability to speak on the microphone blew me away when he debuted. I guess that I shouldn’t have surprised me that a guy who was able to convey such an insane range of emotions while wearing a mask has the charismatic energy that Zayn has, but I was indeed not expecting him to be so comfortable in a speaking role. Sami Zayn is one of those guys that has “it”. He knows how to control a crowd, he is one of the best underdogs of all time and I bet that when he gets the opportunity to go full heel he will knock that out of the park as well. Zayn is the real deal, people. Please don’t let them bring him up to the main roster as Sheamus’ little cousin. I might be more lenient if they carry scales to the ring, though.
Jack Bramma: FICTION – Neville is a good hand and a great worker, but the accent won’t help. Plus, almost no one has more main roster potential than Zayn. Taking off the mask was the best idea in the world for him, because he’s gone from being one of the best workers in the world to one of the next workers in the world with sympathy and great babyface expressions. He could be the best pure babyface of the next 10 years; Neville’s ceiling can’t compare.
Wyatt Beougher: FICTION – If the WWE had simply listened to all of the complainers and brought Zayn in under a mask, then this might be a FACT, but as it stands, Neville has three major things working against him, at least in relation to Sami Zayn. First off, the size differential – while Zayn is no Roman Reigns or John Cena, he is at least over six feet tall and over two hundred pounds. Neville, on the other hand, is three inches shorter than Zayn and roughly ten pounds lighter (based on the height/weight each man is billed at, anyway), which is why he is rumored to be given a Mighty Mouse, small-but-powerful gimmick when he makes his main roster debut. This alone certainly isn’t the kiss of death when it comes to the main roster, but then there is the fact that Neville is a rather odd-looking fellow, with ears that not only stick out rather far from his skull, but also look like they sit low. By comparison, my fifteen-year-old daughter is absolutely smitten with Sami Zayn, who bears more than a passing resemblance to Seth Rogen. And the last factor working against Neville’s main roster success is his accent – unlike say, Sheamus, who is easily understood by even the most rural of American WWE audiences, Neville has a thick Geordie accent that may make it harder for him to connect with those more rural wrestling fans. And this is, again, an area where Zayn will have an advantage, as he speaks unaccented American English and could easily be billed as an American (like fellow Canadians Christian and Chris Jericho have at various points in their careers). For those reasons, and the fact that Zayn is arguably more charismatic and equally as talented in the ring, I think Neville actually has less main roster potential than the man he just lost his NXT title to. But I could be completely wrong when the out-of-touch senior citizen running RAW and Smackdown decides to make Zayn an actual wrestling Seth Rogen, leaving him stuck in Santino-level unfunny skits for the entirety of his main roster career. That, or they play up his Syrian heritage to get him xenophobic heat and then he disappears like Muhammad Hassan. I suppose with Vince still in control of the main roster shows, this is actually a coin flip, but again, I’m choosing to be optimistic about both guys’ main roster fates, and I just think that Zayn has a brighter future than Neville.
5. You consider the WWE Network a failure thus far.
Nick Marsico: FICTION – Absolutely not. While it is not a financially strong endeavor yet, I have faith that it will get there. Like every bold move it is going to have a rough transitional period. The library of material that is already up on demand is gigantic and amazing — and it barely scratches the surface of what they have in their nuclear bunker of storage. WWE has clearly gone all-in on this project, and once it gets on its feet in Canada and launches properly in the UK things will start turning it around. When they work out the worldwide business model, eventually the WWE Network is going to be almost free money for Vince and Company. All good things take time. The WBF and the XFL, two things that a great many people have compared the Network to, were failures because they were horrendous. WWE Films is improving slowly but surely both in quality (debatable, but they’re working on it) and in revenue generation. It’s a long process. Let’s not throw all of the internet’s pessimism at something that is unbelievably awesome. It’s not even a freakin’ year old for God’s sake! With what they have done to the PPV providers there is essentially no going back anyway, so WWE is going to have to stick with this model and they will be forced to make it work — and they will be successful. The content is there, the creative new ideas for programming are coming together and the possibilities are endless. Plus, dude… NXT. That thing is awesome.
Jack Bramma: FICTION – I’m not a stockholder and not dependent on WWE’s unrealistic predictions. I’m a fan and as a fan, the network has been a home run. You can’t beat the deal for $9.99/month. The stock is down because initial estimates and projections were too high and they’ve never been able to keep up. If I was a financial analyst or reporter, I might answer differently but as a consumer, it’s a success.
Wyatt Beougher: FICTION – Considering the Network has been around for over ten months now and the WWE has yet to hit the one million domestic subscriber mark that they said was their profit point, from a business standpoint, this is probably pretty easily a FACT; however, from the perspective of a three decades long wrestling fan and day one network subscriber, it is hard to consider something that gives me so much wrestling content at my fingertips a failure. Whether it’s classic wrestling from The Vault or the best wrestling show today, NXT, there is so much awesome stuff available on the Network right now that no fan of professional wrestling should call it a failure. If nothing else, the WWE Network produced four of the best shows of the year in the NXT Live Specials, not to mention the fact that for $100 (this year, with $20 still left on your second six-month commitment), wrestling fans who subscribed on day one have been able to watch over $460 worth of PPV events this year (assuming your cable/satellite provider doesn’t charge extra to watch them in HD) – how can you call that a failure, unless you own significant shares of WWE stock?
6. The booking of Kevin Owens thus far in NXT has been excellent.
Nick Marsico: FACT – They decided that he was going to be a big deal fairly quick and that’s sure what they’ve done, isn’t it? His third appearance isn’t even set to air until tomorrow night, but in his first two shows he has decimated the two top guys in NXT (the new and former champs) and had them stretchered out of the building to close the broadcast. The expectation was likely that he was going to be an ass-kicking face and that appeared to be the idea after his debut match, but then they ran the angle that closed the show. There is a lot of time to flesh out the Kevin Owens character and we don’t yet know his motivation for taking out Sami Zayn but like most things associated with NXT it is very promising. I went from excited that he was debuting to ecstatic that he’s being pushed into a main role immediately, because that’s where he belongs. Oh, and please give us Owens vs. Balor. Thanks.
Jack Bramma: FACT – The Takeover Revolution aftermath was awesome and so far, it’s a wrestler driven storyline instead of an authority figure driven storyline which is a positive. Also, he looked good and dominant in a double countout with former champ Neville. No complaints so far.
Wyatt Beougher: FACT – While I would have preferred a win over Neville in his second match, I can understand why they would want to keep their former champion strong, and, in spite of that, it’s hard to argue about how Kevin Owens has been brought into NXT. He picked up a decisive win in his debut match on what was easily one of the best domestic shows of the year, was featured in a backstage segment that heavily foreshadowed the very end of the show, his friendship with Sami Zayn was played up throughout the broadcast, and he ended the show by first celebrating and then attacking Zayn, who had just won the NXT championship in what was my US Match of the Year. Unlike KENTA or Prince Devitt or even El Generico, Kevin Steen came into NXT as a main event player, and ending both NXT broadcasts that he has appeared on by power bombing the new champion and the former champion into the ring post certainly makes him feel like the biggest threat in NXT right now, as he has done more in two episodes than guys like Baron Corbin, Bull Dempsey, and the Ascension have done with significantly more time to their name. I think the best part about Owens’ booking thus far is that, as a fan, you actually want to see him get his comeuppance, which is crucial to building a real heel character, and with Sami Zayn being the perfect instance of the increasingly-rare (at least in the modern WWE, anyway) non-asshole babyface, Owens is coming across as the perfect nemesis for Zayn. That seems eerily perfect, considering their history with one another outside of the WWE, and while I will admit to being shocked that the WWE has so overtly referenced that history, it is definitely a pleasant surprise, just like Owens’ booking has been.
