Cheo Hodari Coker Talks w/411 About Luke Cage Season Two, Heroes for Hire Team-Up

411mania recently had the chance to sit down and speak with Luke Cage series showrunner Cheo Hodari Coker for an exclusive interview. Season 2 of the series has just launched on Netflix, and Coker was gracious enough to take some time to talk about the process of bringing Season 2 to the screen.

Cheo Hodari Coker started his career as a hiphop reporter and writer for such publications as VIBE and the Los Angeles Times. His other TV credits include Southland, Almost Human and Ray Donovan before he joined the Marvel Cinematic Universe and became the creator and showrunner for Netflix’s Luke Cage television series. The show first launched in fall 2016 and quickly became a smash hit. Now, Season 2 is finished and released, so Coker was able to speak at length on working on this season. Here’s what he had to say on shepherding Season 2 of Luke Cage

Jeffrey Harris: What is that moment like for you as a creator when you have a show, the season is done, and it’s been released out into the world? Is it cathartic for you?

Cheo Hodari Coker: I guess yes and no. So much about showrunning is that it’s a pie-eating contest where the reward is more pie. And it’s crazy because if you do your job successfully — it really reminds me of when I was at the Los Angeles Times as a reporter, watching a newspaper come together every single day and going to the various departments where its laid out and alternately how very quickly it goes through all these different processes. The photographs are laid out, and it goes to the printer. And then it goes out at the end of every single day. You’ve basically published an entire book worth of information and pages. And then you can’t let anything carry over …. because you start fresh every time. It’s exhilarating, but it’s exhausting because it’s like, “Oh. Here we go.” It’s like Sisyphus. You have to do it all over again. That’s the saying. Season 2, we left it all out on the field. It was exhausting. It’s great. It’s out there, but there’s also a nagging notion that, “OK. We got to get back to it. Here we go.”

Jeffrey Harris: I was very moved by the late, great Reg E. Cathy and his performance as Luke Cage’s father, Reverend James Lucas, this season. What was it like for you to have him on set and to play a really profound, wonderful role this season?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Well, just the voice because Reg E.’s voice is so distinctive. The second that we cast him that entire monologue that I used in the first episode, that I wrote, just popped in my mind. It was just like, literally, “OK. We got Reg E. Cathey?” And I thought about his voice, “People talk about Luke Cage like he’s Jesus!” Because I’ve watched him on The Wire. I’ve watched him on Oz. I’ve watched him all over the place. He always brought the same presence, the same gravitas, but also the same ability to laugh and humor. He was very much the same person in person. That table read we did for the first episode of Season 2 is the best table read I’ve ever been a part of. I mean because he let it off, and then everybody brought their A-game for the rest of the table read. It was really so great. That spirit buoyed us through the entire season. I’m not just saying these nice things about Reg E. because he passed away — rest in peace — but because I’d be saying these things if he was alive. The only regret I have for the entire season is that I didn’t get to sit with him and watch him watch the show because he loved it so much. I think he would’ve loved his own performance.

Jeffrey Harris: One thing I noticed this season is that a lot of characters are having trouble letting go of the anger and pain they are carrying. They use that to fuel them, but it’s also poisoning them. For Luke, it’s his anger toward his father. For Bushmaster, John McIver, it’s his anger for the Stokes family. Was that type of anger a major theme you wanted to cover this season?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Absolutely. We didn’t call it “toxic anger” or use any of these psychological terms, but what’s being described is exactly what we were going for. I think the main thing is that we decided to let the characters live and breathe, flaws and all, because it gave the actors and us as writers places to go as opposed to everybody being perfect or everything is neatly resolved at the end of the episode. So, we couldn’t have it be “Luke Cage’s Angry Episode.” It had to be “Luke Cage’s Angry Arc.” [That] is really what it was. You know, like letting him being affected by anger and letting it spread for a while. And that was important.

Jeffrey Harris: The music for this show is incredible. The soundtrack and music you’ve built into this show might be one of the best soundtracks I’ve ever heard for a show period because you build the music into the narrative. It’s part of the story. It’s not a soundtrack. It’s so much more than that. When did that idea start for you and how you wanted to develop the music for this series?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Here’s the thing. I build it from the inside out. I start with the music and then build everything around the music, and then build it back so that it fits perfectly. My biggest musical influences, in terms of narrative, are the Miami Vice pilot as well as Purple Rain. The thing for me that made me love and geek out for sound, supervision and just how everything from the mix to the song to everything being perfect is that moment in Miami Vice when the cop’s down, Sonny Crockett’s at the wheel, Tubbs is loading the shotgun and Phil Collins “In The Air Tonight” is beginning to build. It’s not just the song, the Phil Collins and the way that it builds. It’s the fact that you can hear him loading the shotgun, and just the way it elevates the whole scene, It’s like, “Aw man. I cannot wait to see what they’re about to do.” I’ve been trying to recreate that moment of execution in terms of song and mood and action for my whole entire career. That’s really the fun of it.

Jeffrey Harris: Just for example, in that scene with Bushmaster in Harlem’s Paradise, with Kingfish performing onstage, Bushmaster starts speaking about the silent blues, do you think about the music and the song first, and then write the scene around the musical performance?

Cheo Hodari Coker: I discovered Kingfish online. I knew that he was the future of the blues. He’s brilliant. So, once we were able to get him, knowing that we were going to build around “I Put A Spell On You,” because it’s the mysticism. Once I heard the song — once Adrian [Younge], Ali [Shaheed Muhammad] and I recorded Kingfish live at Adrian’s studio, and I heard the solo, then I knew the speech. And then, Matt Lopes, the writer of the episode, he had feelings about the song and the moment as well. It was basically building in different in ways, that moment and what that moment was going to represent. And so that you have the intercut between what’s being played onstage and the conversation that these two families are having about the ownership of the club. It’s also at the same time Reggae vs. the Blues in terms of ownership of Harlem and of hiphop in addition to these two characters who are fighting themselves and Luke Cage. So, you always build from the inside and work your way out.

Jeffrey Harris: In constructing Season 2, were there any main goals or pillars you wanted to nail down for Luke’s journey?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Not really. I want to say something grandiose and smart, but I don’t really have anything. We knew as a writing that we wanted to challenge ourselves to make sure that Luke’s arc throughout the season at the end was going to be an entire evolution. Even as fascinated as we are by the Stokeses and the McIvers, we never lose sight of the Lucases — being Carl Lucas (Luke Cage).

Jeffrey Harris: This season was also a great arc for Misty Knight (Simone Missick) and coming back from having lost her arm in The Defenders and basically having to rebuild herself. So, what was it like to not only provide the introduction of Misty for the MCU, but also build her into a hero in her own right?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Thank you. Thank you for Simone Missick. Thank god for Simone Missick because Simone Missick brings just as much heat as Misty Knight as Mike Colter brings to Luke Cage. You have an actress that is hungry, that is incredibly focused on her craft, but at the same time is sensitive and nurturing and listens and always has great suggestions, but really thinks in terms of her character period. I could say more, but it would just sound saccharine because she’s just so brilliant and beautiful in everything she does. And she’s equally as poised as Mike Colter is. And so really, it’s just striking that balance making sure that everyone is where they need to be.

Jeffrey Harris: Without giving anything away, Season 2 ends with Luke Cage in a very different place. And his role as Harlem’s Hero has evolved into something else. Was this where you always wanted to end with Luke when you began writing Season 2?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Yes. Each season, I put out a season overview. And the season overview for Season 2 was that Luke was going to end up on that balcony. And we were just trying to figure out the best way to get him up there. I don’t think we anticipated the emotional journey that it would take, but I’m so glad that we figured it out. I really feel like that this entire season is phenomenal. I’m so excited to be a part of it. Even though everyone is biased about their own stuff, I think that Season 2 is just really great television, period, and I love it.

Jeffrey Harris: Are you ready to go ahead and announce Season 3 now?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Well, I could, but I’d be a liar. It hasn’t been ordered yet.

Jeffrey Harris: But are you thinking about Season 3 and where Luke can go next?

Cheo Hodari Coker: You begin thinking about Season 3 as you’re writing Season 2, but that doesn’t mean any of its going to happen. I’m just focused on us hopefully being renewed period.

Jeffrey Harris: We’re finally getting some nice products, statues and action figures based on the show now. Has Hasbro sent you any of the action figures for Luke Cage and Marvel Netflix yet?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Nope. I mean, nobody sends me anything. It kind of sucks. But I mean, the toys are cool. I’ve got a Luke Cage statue on my desk. I’m glad that they’re finally making toys and that we’re doing well enough that they want to have merchandise out there. But you know, I don’t get free merchandise, but I do get to know what happens.

Jeffrey Harris: My favorite episode in Season 2 was probably episode 10 because Danny Rand (Iron Fist) showed up, and it was basically like getting a Heroes for Hire or Marvel Team-Up story in the middle of the show. How was it getting to bring in Iron Fist for an episode this season?

Cheo Hodari Coker: Akela Cooper, who wrote episode 10, did an incredible job. We paired her again with Andy Goddard. Andy Goddard and Akela together also did episode 1.7, the controversial Cottonmouth death episode. So, we knew that putting them back together was going to be charged and really great. It was really just a great episode. I love the fact that as a room, we were able to just do a cool Danny Rand story. Our goal was to make people love Danny Rand as much as we love Danny Rand, despite all the flack that he got for [Iron Fist] Season 1. I was glad that we were able to do that. And to save time, my favorite part because I took all the music was matching that fight with Wu-Tang [Clan]. That was great.

Jeffrey Harris: It was a great time an a great season. Thank you for your time, and I look forward to what’s next for Luke Cage in the future. Keep up the great work.

Cheo Hodari Coker: Thank you so much.

Thank you to Cheo Hodari Coker for taking the time to speak with us. Marvel’s Luke Cage Season 2 is available now on Netflix. You can also check out 411’s official review Season 2 RIGHT HERE.