wrestling / Columns
Ask 411 Wrestling 02.25.09: Shades of Grey, Shooting Japanese, and Just Who Is The Highest Grosser In History?
Welcome back to the only column posted today by an Australian who’s wondering if Mickey Rourke is either cool with the WWE, blaming his Oscar loss on politics or if he blames it on the WWE, and what this means for Jericho at WM, Ask 411 Wrestling!
So the Legends of Wrestlemania roster list is out, and what I had feared to be simple rehashing is actually ok. Savage and Foley I didn’t expect, given their embargo at the start, but Masked Kane and Miss Elizabeth missing kinda surprised me. Although I still want Tully and IRS in the game, but hopefully the CAW (and Create a Manager as well) will cover them. Although can you use wrestlers as managers? After all, Flair would have Arn at ringside…
Ask 411’s ULTIMATE WRESTLEMANIA!
Results!
A very close set of votes, with only one clear winner, the others going to tiebreak (i.e. I trolled a couple of wrestling forums until I found someone to vote for me.
Announcing this prestigious event, we have…
Jim Ross, Gorilla Monsoon, and Jesse ‘The Body’ Ventura!
I’ll admit, this one caught me off guard, but one of the legendary double acts in WWE history coupled with perhaps the best announcer they’ve ever had, it does make sense.
And the first match of the evening will see…
Randy ‘Macho Man’ Savage V Chris Jericho- Falls Count Anywhere!
A very close run thing, with Benoit/Steamboat giving this a run for it’s money. But Savage/Jericho, which fits nicely with this year’s event, will kick off the show, with the added bonus of no rules to hinder them.
And finally this week, the women of the WWE will be represented in…
Beth Phoenix V Lita V Trish Stratus V Victoria!
Have I mentioned how much I love you guys recently?
Voting
High Flying
Note, some nominations were DQed for having Miz, London, Kendrick etc. Also, some noms were removed since they included Jericho. If it’s in bold, it was nominated more than once.
2 Cold Scorpio V Shelton Benjamin V TAKA Michinoku V Ultimo Dragon- 25 Minute Championship Scramble
Scrambling always makes it better
Billy Kidman V Eddie Guerrero V John Morrison V Rey Mysterio V Tajiri V X-Pac
Past, present, future, it’s got it all!
Bubba Ray Dudley/D-Von Dudley V Christian/Edge V Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy V Rob Van Dam/Sabu- TLC match
Hell of a 4th team to add.
Chavo Guerrero/Eddie Guerrero V Christian/Edge V Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy V Rey Mysterio/Shawn Michaels- TLC Match
What’s wrong with the Dudleys?
Eddie Guerrero V Owen Hart
Yes please.
Eddie Guerrero V Owen Hart V Rey Mysterio V Rob Van Dam
I’m like a kid in a candy store.
Eddie Guerrero V Ricky ‘The Dragon’ Steamboat
Quite a contrast.
Jeff Hardy V Matt Hardy V Rey Mysterio V Rob Van Dam
Every man for himself!
Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy V Marty Jannetty/Shawn Michaels
The Hardys V The Rockers was a popular submission.
Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy V Rey Mysterio/Rob Van Dam
Spot a pattern?
Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy V Rob Van Dam/Ultimo Dragon
Team Up In Smoke?
Jeff Hardy/Matt Hardy/The Blue Blazer V Marty Jannetty/Rey Mysterio/Shawn Michaels
Hardys and Blazer V Rockers and Shorty?
Jimmy ‘Superfly’ Snuka V Shelton Benjamin
Ah, the thinking man’s high flying match.
John Morrison V Rey Mysterio
Coming to a Raw near you…
Rey Mysterio V Ricky ‘The Dragon’ Steamboat
Here comes the second pattern…
Rey Mysterio V Rob Van Dam
Tag Partners Explode!
Rey Mysterio V Shane McMahon
What, no hardcore rules?
Rey Mysterio V Shawn Michaels
God would like this one.
Rey Mysterio V TAKA Michinoku w/Funaki
Cruiserweight title V Light Heavyweight title!
Big Guy
Ahmed Johnson V Akebono V Albert V Andre the Giant V Bam Bam Bigelow V Batista V Big John Studd V Bobby Lashley V Brock Lesner V Bull Buchanan V Butterbean V Chris Masters V Crush V Dusty Rhodes V Earthquake V George ‘The Animal’ Steele V Giant Gonzalez V Goldust V Hacksaw Jim Duggan V Haku V Hillbilly Jim V JBL V Junk Yard Dog V Kamala V Kane V Kevin Nash V King Kong Bundy V Kurrgan V Lawrence Taylor V Lex Luger V Mabel V Mark Henry V Nikolai Volkoff V One Man Gang V Rikishi V Sid V Test V The Big Boss Man V The Big Show V The Godfather V The Great Khali V The Ultimate Warrior V The Undertaker V The Warlord V Tugboat V Umaga V Vader V William ‘Refrigerator’ Perry V Yokozuna- Over The Top Battle Royale
Sweet Jesus.
Andre the Giant V Bam Bam Bigelow V Big John Studd V Earthquake V Giant Gonzalez V Kamala V Kane V King Kong Bundy V Mabel V Mark Henry V One Man Gang V Rikishi V Sid V The Big Boss Man V The Big Show V The Great Khali V Tugboat V Umaga V Vader V Yokozuna- Over The Top Battle Royale
That’s a little more manageable…
Andre The Giant V The Big Show
Very Popular.
Andre The Giant V The Ultimate Warrior
Just because Andre hated him…
Andre The Giant V The Undertaker
Another big choice.
Andre The Giant V The Undertaker w/Paul Bearer
Establish heel/face lines.
Andre The Giant V Yokozuna
I always liked Yoko…
Andre The Giant w/Ted DiBiase V The Big Show w/JBL- Million Dollar Bodyslam Challenge
Very interesting.
Andre The Giant/Haku V The Big Show/Umaga
Colossal Connection V Team Savage!
Andre The Giant/King Kong Bundy/The Big Show V Earthquake/One Man Gang/Yokozuna
Will the ring hold that?
Andre The Giant/The Big Show V Kane/The Undertaker
‘Brothers’ V ‘Father And Son’
Andre the Giant/The Undertaker w/Captain Lou Albano/Paul Bearer V The Big Show/Yokozuna w/Jim Cornette/Mr. Fuji
Managers out the yingyang…
Bam Bam Bigelow V Vader
ECW V WCW!
Big John Studd/King Kong Bundy w/Akebono V The Big Show/Yokozuna w/Mr. Fuji
Salt will get thrown.
Brock Lesnar V The Ultimate Warrior
Splash into F5?
Brock Lesnar V Vader
Vaderbomb into F5?
Goldberg V The Ultimate Warrior
Spear into…Spear?
Kane V The Undertaker
ONE…MORE…TIME!
The Big Show V Vader
Well, they can both work…
The Big Show/Vader V Umaga/Yokozuna
Interesting, interesting…
The Ultimate Warrior V The Undertaker
Unstoppable means Unmovable.
Vader V Yokozuna
Would be cool.
Nominations
The Workrate Match
Possible Options: Kurt Angle V Bob Backlund, 60 Minute Iron Man match, Kurt Angle V Bret Hart, 60 Minute Ultimate Submission match, Kurt Angle V Ric Flair, First to 10 falls wins.
&
The Celeb Match
For this match, the celebrity does not have to have been in a match prior, and there must be at least one celeb involved.
Possible Options: Kane V Pete Rose- No Holds Barred, Elvira/Jake Roberts V Cathy Lee Crosby/Ricky Steamboat, Pamela Anderson V Sunny, Bra and Panties match
Backtalking
WWE Stock: For the final word on WWE stock, and just what the differences are and if HHH owns them, I turned to 411Mania’s resident Financial Whiz Kid, JP Prag. JP?
Neither “Common” nor “Restricted” stock is good or bad, but just a reference from where the stock comes from. Common stock is what is available for trade on the open market with no restrictions. These are all of the shares the WWE sold in their initial IPO, what they released since then, and what has been sold by employees and organizations granted stock over time. “Restricted” usually means there is a vesting period before the stock can be sold. For instance, WWE CFO George Barrios may be granted 20,000 shares of WWE stock, but he is not allowed to sell them for five years. So he does have the stock and receives the benefits of being a voting shareholder and receiving the dividend, but he can’t see the stock at this time. After the stock vests and the period expires, the stock gets converted to Common stock and he is free to trade it on the open market.
Now as for preferred stock, companies sometimes create a level of stock that have things like super voting rights. For instance, one share of preferred stock could give you 10 votes compared to a one-to-one relationship for common stock. Also, preferred stock holders are usually given higher priority in a liquidation or bankruptcy over regular stock holders (but after debt claims).
What is confusing is that the WWE has “Class A” and “Class B” stock. Both of these stocks are common and have a one-to-one relationship with voting. However, the Class A stock is the open market one that receives the $0.36 per quarter dividend while the Class B stock is the “McMahon Family” version that has a $0.24 per quarter dividend. There are a few other people that have Class B stock, but it gives no special rights or privileges; it is just a way for the McMahons to keep themselves on a different cycle. That said, there are FAR more Class B stocks than Class A, but Class B can be converted to Class A (and vice versa) at any time as approved by the board of directors.
As for finding out if and how much stock Triple H has, it would be pretty difficult. Typically, one major shareholders (those with 3% or more of the outstanding stock) need to declare their holdings publicly to the SEC. Also, Triple H could use a foundation or service to own the stock, thus it is not directly in his name. Most major firms will release their portfolios, and some individuals with insider trading knowledge will also release the information they have. You can see major shareholders in both individuals and institutions here:
WWE’s finance page on Yahoo (click the “Major Shareholders” link on the left side)
Also, do not forget that since Triple H is married to Stephanie McMahon, many of their assets are tied together. If you click the “Insider Transactions” and “Insider Roster” links in the site above, you can see how many shares she owns and what transactions she has recently made.
Going there, Steph sold 224 shares to someone a while back, maybe to HHH. Or maybe he’s Blackrock. But he doesn’t own a large percentage, because if he did, it would be there.
MITB as a WM Way Out: After I posted the column, Money In The Bank as a panic button to give the fans a WM Main Event did occur to me. It does work, except that it’s often given to guys just moving up, so they may not be ready to call a WM Main Event on the fly, AND the MITB deal is a pretty big storyline for the company, and they might not want to blow it out of the water, even if it’s for a good cause. And redoing it at Backlash would be silly.
Shawn Michaels at WM X7: First I heard of a re-injured back. I mean, I took the fact that he was too drugged out so they pulled him from the WWE DVD they did on Shawn, but by all means, if you have sources, bring them up.
Rick Rude’s Tights: Were, according to PMR2K1, done by a gentleman named Jim in Clearwater, Florida who has since retired from airbrushing. So there you go.
Big Show’s Agility: Yeah, back in WCW, The Giant could, when he wanted to, move quite well, before injures and a sense of his size and what was appropriate kicked in. Heck, during this match, he kips up, albeit with the help of the ropes. Click here for the video. That’s Giant V Curt Hennig, who also shows some power by nailing the Hennig-Plex on the big guy.
Brandi/Wilkes and The Patriot: My sincere apolgoies… No, wait, that won’t work.
I got it wrong, apparently Tom Brandi is, according to Del Wilkes, a filthy liar. He put out a message a few weeks ago-
Del Wilkes, best known as The Patriot, is upset about the usage of The Patriot name on the independent scene. Bill Behrens sent out this release today on his behalf.
I heard today from Del Wilkes, who wrestled as The Patriot in Global Wrestling and in WWE.
He retired from wrestling a while back but does occasionally do autograph appearances.
Wilkes called because Tom Brandi, who appears frequently in the NE as The Patriot (as well as Salvatore Sincere, often both on one show), has been telling folks that he bought the Patriot gimmick from Wilkes and is using it legally and properly.
Wilkes says that is not true, and that Brandi is simply using the gimmick and trademark without his permission and illegally. Wilkes says he has not communicated with Brandi nor has seen him since 1994.
In addition, Wilkes says that photos used to promote Brandi and that Brandi sells at indy shows are actually Wilkes WWE promo photos and has the WWE logos on the photos.
I’ve seen promotion for Brandi where he’s been called the WWE’s Patriot, which clearly he was not and violates copyrights laws.
Del Wilkes did not say whether he planned to take any action against Tom Brandi for the fraud he has been committing, but wanted to inform everyone of the situation.
Wilkes asked that I get this story out to everyone.
Sorry about that.
Your Turn, Smart Guy…
Before we begin- Cowboy Bob Orton was the correct answer, under the definition I gave you. Overall he’s not, but under my definition of an appearance in the list, he was the right answer.
Last week’s answer was indeed the European Title Tourney. Most everyone got it out, except the impersonation. During the finals, Honky Tonk Man did a Stu Hart impersonation that was pretty dead on. Not quite “Heyman doing Steve Austin” level, but still stunning nevertheless.
Anyway, onto this week’s question.
Name someone who has had a PPV match against each of the following at least once- Andre The Giant, Steve Austin, Honky Tonk Man, Arn Anderson, Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Randy Savage, Mr. Perfect AND Curt Hennig, The Undertaker, Glen Jacobs in two different gimmicks, both Quebecers in two different gimmicks, and all this with basically the same gimmick himself?
Questions, Questions, Who’s Got The Questions?
Guest#4902 starts us off.
At No Way Out 2009, the WWE Championship changed hands in the opening match, other than No Mercy 2007, when was the last time a WWE Championship changed hands in an opening match of a PPV.
The ECW title changed hands in the first match at last years Unforgiven, Matt Hardy winning the ECW Scramble match to become the NEW ECW Champion. But you want to say that that isn’t a World Title, and that you were asking about a world title changing hands (because other titles have changes in the first match all the time), no, only at NWO 09 and No Mercy 07 has the first match of a WWE PPV seen a world title change hands.
Captain Greatness insults you, the reader. Sort of.
Good work… Why must the IWCers hate on everything? Is it because they all lead such unfulfilling lives that they have nothing better to do than to read about a fake sport and make “enlightened” commentary because they know better than the people who create the fake sport themselves? Or because they just KNOW while others who may have to research aren’t up to their level? There’s a line in a song from Sloan, a Canadian rock band, “It’s not the band I hate, it’s their fans.” Pretty much sums up my opinion of the so called IWC.
Anyways, speaking of the IWC, one of the 1000 things they’ve been bellyaching about recently is that the WWE is now “booking for children.” What does this mean exactly? I’m led to believe that this means its no longer “shades of grey” that Vince once went on air to declare as dumb… As in he didn’t want the fans “intelligence insulted” by booking “Good Guys vs. Bad Guys” But it seems to me that not long after that, probably 2 or 3 months, Vince became the Uber-heel and Austin became to biggest face in the business. Did the “shades of grey” last much shorter than people want to believe? And that the Manichean concept of “Good Guys vs. Bad Guys” is and has always been the dominant narrative force of the industry, let alone narrative itself? Perhaps I’m confused about the whole “shades of grey” thing and how Good vs. Bad is for kids and not the “smart” (using that term loosely) marks of the IWC.
Part of the problem in dealing with this is that some people use terms without knowing what they mean, and others use the same term to mean wildly different things. ‘Shades of Grey’, for instance, is often used as a catch-all for Russo’s Style of Booking, ala Crash TV and/or ‘Crap’.
But to try and bring some sort of semblance of sanity to the discussion (a pipe dream I know), basically, Shades of Grey booking is creating characters and feuds, then letting people cheer and boo whoever the hell they want. You take Wrestler A, have him turn on Wrestler B after B makes a move on A’s Girl C, then they begin to fight. The fans then choose if they want to cheer A for standing up for his girl, boo A for being over protective, or just chant dirty things at C in the hope she’ll take her shirt off. This concept is coupled with consistency in characters (Austin was exactly the same guy when he was a ‘heel’ and when he was a ‘face’), and a memory for history, two aspects often overlooked by Russo haters.
In the WWF at the time, this concept led to such situations as The Hart Foundation being beloved outside the US and hated within it, DX going from hated jerks to beloved wisecrackers, and Mick Foley being embraced. But even while DX was running high, and feuding with the Nation of Domination, if you wanted to cheer for Rock and Owen, you weren’t discouraged, you weren’t looked down upon, you just liked Rock and Owen. And for the most part, everyone loved Austin and hated Vince, so that was a solid rock upon which you could build shaky outposts.
Part of the reason Vince made the ‘Good Guys V Bad Guys’ speech was because the WWE was aiming at an older demographic, the kids that had grown up idolising Hogan were now teenagers, cynical and twisted (which I’m sure had nothing to do with the Hogan worship), and wanted entertainment to suit them. Vince, seeing he money, went there, and that speech was designed to play to cynical teenagers. And now he’s heading back to the kids to start all over again.
And that’s where the problem lies. When you book to kids, you need to be a lot less subtle, and more clear cut. You need to establish that Randy Orton is very bad and that HHH is very good, because kids can’t handle adult storylines with no clear cut good guys and bad guys, supposedly. Hence the backlash to Cena, since when he was getting the mega push, the kids loved him but all the adult males still in the audience booed him, and WWE tried to stop them. Short of flat out telling them to cheer Cena, WWE did all they could to try and get consistency in their responses because right now, that’s where the money is. Supposedly.
Although honestly, I still don’t understand why WWE doesn’t run with Cena as the Uber Face/ Uber Heel thing. I mean, two different markets, one guy, and they can both run at the exact same time, seems like a winner to me. But that’s shades of grey, and that’s not in right now.
But the fact remains that the IWC is mostly adult males, and adult males want the product tailored to them. It’s not right now, so they are pissy about it. Give it 10 years, and when Cena turns heel and forms nWo 2k20, watch out though…
Birdman, you had a question?
Maybe I missed it, but why didn’t anyone at 411 Headquarters review Bret Hart’s new book?
Not a full review, no. Mike Chin loved it, and I’ve seen a couple of other people on site mention it, but since 411 didn’t get any copies to review, no-one reviewed it. Besides, we don’t really have a book reviewer on staff. Hmm, that’s an opening.
Ben Stickle asks a silly question.
When will Edge become the Rated-PG Superstar?
‘Coz then him and Vickie can have hot passionate handshakes or something.
The day WWE gets an X rating, since Edge is all about being a heel. Once sex and violence becomes common, then Edge becomes Mr. Conservative.
Conor O’Boyle has another Russo question. Gee, it’s like you all think that just because I don’t hate him I can explain everything about him…
Hey Matt!
1. Is it true that Russo wanted Kane to job to Undertaker clean the night of his debut at Bad Blood??
Not the night of his debut, but the very next night, supposedly. Admittedly that’s only urban legend, but it does fit with Russo’s inability to understand that you tell stories to the PPVs, you have the climaxs at the show you make the most money off of. Russo doesn’t think like that, hence you often get PPVs building to TV, not the other way around. It makes sense in normal creative storytelling, but not Wrestling, something Russo has NEVER come to grips with.
2. I Wiki’d Koji Kitao the other day, as I remember him teaming with Tenyru at Wrestlemania 7, but then it said that he started shooting on Earthquake in a house show or TV Tapings, going stiff on him, then cutting a promo on how fake wrestling is and its all make believe. Now was that true or Wiki being dodgy like it can be at times, cause it is the first I heard of this.
Nope, this is 100% accurate. And I have video!
To explain- This was a joint show between the WWF and SWS, Super World of Sports, held in Japan. Both Koji and Earthquake had a background in Sumo, and Koji… I dunno, got pissy at Earthquake, perhaps for being overly stiff or something, and just went mental. Since this was April 1st, 1991, it was a little early for a Shoot Angle, and it certainly wasn’t a April Fools Joke. Koji apparently got up on the wrong side of the bed.
Colm asks about SAG. The guild, not a condition or anything.
A chara!
Always read the article, helps get me through the day. Anyway, what with people suggesting that WWE’s pro wrestlers should try to join the Screen Actor’s Guild … it got me wondering, are there any wrestlers with the big companies who are already members? I would have thought that someone like Chris Jericho may have joined during his hiatus, especially seeing as he appeared in a few films.
Yes, anyone who has appeared in more than one film or TV show that is covered by SAG rules has to be a member unless both roles are done within 30 days. I remember seeing a scan of The Rock’s card as his acting career started, where he was listed as ‘The Rock’ and was giving the eyebrow in his picture.
That said, in regards to full time wrestlers on staff, it’s hard to say if guys like Cena, Kennedy and DiBiase would keep their memberships or let them lapse. Logically, you’d expect them to keep them, but they might not want to risk annoying Vince.
But as a general rule, if they’ve acted in a film of TV show outside of the WWE (not a reality show), then they are almost certainly SAG members. Unless it’s a small role, in which case they may have been a Taft-Hartley job. You can look that up if you really want to.
Joel gets all morbid on us.
Great job on the column man.
After watching the end of “The Wrestler” I tried to remember occasions where a planned finish to a match (PPV or TV) had to be obviously altered due to an injury.
1- Can you name some instances that you can remember where a pin was ‘obviously’ forced due to injury on a PPV or TV?
Outside of worked shoot angles, the most obvious answer would be Eddie Guerrero and Perry Saturn vs. The New Age Outlaws, 3rd of February, 2000. Eddie dislocated his elbow severely, and damm near screamed out for the Outlaws to pin him, thus changing the storyline of the night and then the whole Radical arc, as the idea had been for DX to screw the Radicals out of the their contracts, leading to an 8 man tag at No Way Out, and instead we had Cactus Jack/HHH, Hell In A Cell.
2- Can you name some instances that you can remember where the match had to be STOPPED (no pin) in the middle of a match due to injury on a PPV or TV?
I know there have been several, but the one I remember most vividly was Villano IV’s neck injury on the September 21, 1998 edition of Nitro, where Kanyon and Raven messed up a Powerbomb/Neckbreaker combo and dropped Villano right on his head. Raven broke character immediately and help Villano’s head still to prevent him from moving and injuring himself further, the match stopping dead in it’s tracks.
To lighten the moode, comedy time! Since the video I wanted to use isn’t embeddable, I’ve had to improvise.
This’d be Aurora Rose in a couple years I bet you.
Joshua forces me to call in some outside help.
So a few weeks ago I was reading an article…….Right here on 411mania!!!…..anyways, the author had made the statement that Steve Austin was the highest grossing WWE Champion of all time. Now I would never doubt a 411 write, nor am I saying I don’t believe it, but lets look at this:
Steve Austin won his first WWE Title in 1998 and was retired by 2003, giving him roughly 5 years on the top of the card.
Hulk Hogan won his first WWE Title in 1984 and left the company in 1993, giving him roughly 9 years on the top of the card.
Now I’m not some big Hogan mark, trust me, I just want to know how Austin is the highest grossing WWE Champion of all time. Also, what is meant by “Highest Grossing Champion” does that mean that Austin made more money than Hogan? Or does it mean that Austin made the WWE more money than Hogan? I know when Hogan was champion there were only four PPVs per year and in the early part of this WWE career there were only one or two PPVs per year. When Austin was WWE Champ there were 12 PPVs per year. I’m sure that factors in greatly right? Well if you could shine some light on this.
JP again steps into the breach.
This is a difficult question because you have to qualify it. If we are talking straight dollars and just “gross” (as opposed to “net”, because that makes a big different), Austin, Rock, and John Cena are all in contention. But that has to be weighed against several things:
– Inflation: Due to changes in money values and the cost of products, on average in the United States there is a 3% per year inflation rate. That means that $1.0000 in today’s money is worth $0.9700 in next year’s money $0.9409 the following years $0.9127 in the next, etc… (in a simplified model). In reverse, Something that cost $1.0000 today would cost $1.0300 next year, $1.0609 the next, $1.0927 the following, etc…. So although a Hulk Hogan T-shirt in 1987 may have cost $10, that $10 is equivalent to $18.59 today. But that brings up another factor.
– Supply/Demand and customer perceived value: The WWE has grown by leaps in bounds since the ’80s and has increased their overall audience. With that, demand rises for their products (especially during a major up period like 1997 to 2000). When demand increases more than supply, the price of a product goes up much further than just with inflation alone. Also during that time period, how customers perceive items has changed. Today, a t-shirt from the WWE cost $25, which would be $13.45 in 1987 dollars. Would someone in 1987 believe a t-shirt was worth more than $10? Most likely not. But the perception of what a t-shirt is has changed over time so nowadays that is an acceptable amount.
– Product diversification: Hulk Hogan spent most of the 1980’s and early 1990’s with one or two t-shirt designs, a couple of action figures, and a few things he was licensed to like lunch boxes, light switches, video games, etc…. John Cena today has nearly 80 different type of items listed for him on WWEShop.com. When you have more and different products you either have the same people buy more from the same wrestler, different people who buy different products, or a combination of both. Not even Austin or Rock had the diversification in products that John Cena, Jeff Hardy or even Santino Marella have today. Hulk Hogan certainly did not have this type of option.
– Product availability and audience size: In the 1980’s, the only place to buy wrestling merchandise was at live events or in a few stores that carried them. that meant that even people who wanted the products would have trouble tracking them down. Starting in the late 1990’s, more stores began to carry wrestling related merchandise. Today, there is the internet for anything that people want to buy, the WWE has a wider net for touring, and plenty of stores carry their items. Also, in the 1980’s the WWE was just doing a national expansion and had just begun some international growth in Canada, Mexico, the UK, Japan, and a few other European countries. Today, the WWE is on in 130 countries, so there is a much larger audience pool to sell products to than there used to be.
So when talking about gross revenue, you really have to qualify what you mean. From a straight dollar standpoint, there is no way Hogan can come close to Austin due to inflation, price growth, availability, and the other factors. But if you put in those factors and make it on a per capita basis (per person available), than you are talking a whole different story.
Yeah.
Randy Scott goes back a couple years.
I just watched last year’s NWO on DVD. In the SmackDown Elimination Chamber match Undertaker was thrown against the Door and it opened and Taker took a nasty fall out the door and landed on his left arm but he shook it off and got back in there, but it looked unplanned . I’m thinking the referee didn’t lock or fasten the door. Undertaker was lucky his arm wasn’t broken in that fall or he didn’t suffer some other injury but am I right in assuming it was a botched moment? I know they happen.
Yes, absolutely. The problem arose because, as you say, the door wasn’t fastened correctly, although to be fair steel cages don’t normally have one side that totally opens up like that. Taker assumed that he could hit the wall and bounce back, but instead the door opened and he nearly took a nasty tumble. But yes, it was a botch, and yes, he was lucky.
Bryan goes back to the money.
Is TNA in as bad of shape financially and creatively as WCW was in it’s final year?
Well, creatively is an argument you can have all day long. But financially, not by a long shot. WCW at the end was haemorrhaging money left right and center. TNA this year will, assuming all things hold, turn a profit. TNA, despite all the mistakes they have made, are making money, shockingly.
And if WCW was around today, do you think Eric Bischoff would go to Congress for a bailout? Would dying his hair black and wearing his NWO intimidate the Democrats in charge over their to give them the cash?
Not when they could drag out Hillary Clinton to counteract Eric.
But no, Wrestling isn’t bailout material, in that it isn’t deeply interconnected with everything else nor is it a vital part of society. Congress would just tell them to merge with WWE and be done with it.
My Damm Opinion
Matt Snelling abuses his position.
Hello from 411 Sports!
I hope that I’m not abusing my position as a fellow 411er to get this question bumped up to the front of the queue in any sort of way, that really would be abusing privileges now. Anyway good column my friend, and I’ve always been a big fan of the Evolution Schematic, but enough of the flattery, here’s my question…
I was reading somewhere else on the site about commentators in wrestling and how there is a bit of a dearth in quality at the moment. It got me to thinking. Has there been any widespread use of women as commentators? For a point of interest, I’m a big footba…sorry ‘soccer’ fan (cheap plug: If you want to read 411’s Premier football/soccer column please go to the sports section and enjoy ‘Breaking the Offside Trap’ every week) and there was a big deal made around a year or so ago when they had the first female (Jacqui Oatley) doing commentary on a televised football match here in Britain.
Now, obviously this stirred passions, a lot of people, including a lot of old pro’s came out and said that she was terrible and that she couldn’t ‘know the game’. There was also criticism that she was given the role as a gimmick as well as issues made (incredibly) about stuff such as the pitch of her voice being off putting. A quote from a journalist at the time: ‘It is an insult to the controlled commentaries of John Motson, Mike Ingham and Alan Green that their domain is threatened by a new arrival whose excited voice sounds like a fire siren’
So then, after that rather long winded intro, Is this something you think a wrestling company in the mainstream would try? Do you think WWE/TNA would ever look to recruit a female sports broadcaster? Or do you think that any of the current or former women who have graced/are gracing the industry with their presence would be given a serious go?
Thank you for your time and consideration then sir, I hope it wasn’t too long winded. Keep up the good work on the web’s foremost site on popular culture.
Well, SHIMMER has Allison Danger on color commentary, but then that’s to be expected since she both is co-owner and it’s an all female fed (well, all female except for Larry Sweeney). But in terms of the main two (can I call ROH big yet? I mean, it’s about to enter into late ECW territory, so the Big Three might become a viable phrase again…), it depends.
Although, before I’m mugged, I must point out that Lita had a stint as color commentator on Heat, while her neck healed. She didn’t set the world on fire, but WWE can say that they have had a female commentator.
TNA might be willing to do something crazy like stick Traci Brooks into the announce booth or some such, although I doubt it would last long since they seem reluctant to remove West and Tenay’s the best option available. WWE on the other hand… It’s possible, it just depends on how the next generation of owners views it. If Steph ends up in power, perhaps. But perhaps not. Part of the problem is a lack of female announcers who can talk with authority. I mean, Chyna could, but she’s insane so that’s out.
But as for who might be able to do it, Ivory could probably slide in fairly easily given her time as a presenter, and women like Molly Holly, Trish Stratus and Cheerleader Melissa might. To be an announcer, you need a clear, strong voice, be quick on your toes, and above all, understand either the wrestling business inside and out or be extremely experienced in sports broadcasting and thus know how to tell a story. So the list of women who fit that bill is sadly quite small.
But then again Matt Striker of all people is the second coming of Heenan on the mic, so what do I know?
Dominic asks about the loudest pop I’ve ever heard.
What is the biggest pop you have ever heard? I would have to say Austin hitting the rock with the chair to help mankind win hie first WWF title. Just curious what your answer would be.
See?
Loudest single pop…Austin wins the title at WMX7. Despite turning heel, that reaction was monster. Special note to Goldberg beating Hogan and the Hart Foundation existing during the IYH: Canadian Stampede show.
And finally, Steve?
1) I read your reasoning for why XIX was not the best Mania, but I’m curious in your opinion, if you could limit Mana to the best 3 or 4 matches, which Manias would be the best in your opinion.
Always enjoy the article. Keep it up.
So, just taking the top matches, which Manias would be the best. Hmm. My top 5, in no order.
X7- Still my favourite PPV of all time, Rock/Austin, TLC, Benoit/Angle, Raven/Show/Kane, Shane/Vince… Could have been better, sure, but it’s still f’ing awesome.
XXIV- HBK/Flair, MITB, HBK/Flair, Edge/Taker, HBK/Flair and, uh, HBK/Flair.
XX- Trish Stratus Turning Heel. My Favourite Moment EVER.
X- The Ladder Match and Owen/Bret. What else do you need?
21- The first MITB, Angle/HBK, and Taker/Orton.
What about you guys?
