411 Wrestling Fact or Fiction: Was the Ending of Wrestlemania 41 Dumb?

Welcome back to the 411mania Wrestling Fact or Fiction. I’m your host Jake Chambers.

Well, I don’t know about you, but I’m still exhausted. That’s a whole lot of wrestling. Well, wrestling TV, not actual wrestling… but we’ll get to that later.

To join me in trying to put brain in the proper order is the always together, no matter how much wrestling he’s watched, Kevin Pantoja!

He’s the Wiseman to my Michael McGillicutty, so let’s not waste anymore time and get right to the backstabbing groin shots!

Statement #1: The endings to Wrestlemania 41, both Saturday and Sundays nights, were dumb.

Jake Chambers: FACT – I wanted to say “dumb as shit” in the statement, but I’ll be nice and just say it here in my response instead. I know that it’s a meaningless metaphor, but it’s emphatically stupid and that seems appropriate.

First, you’ve got a Triple Threat main event that was not for a title but rather seemingly for the valet services of an old guy kayfabe “wiseman”. These services provide no extra strategy to help win matches, because all matches at the WWE main event level are just guys hitting finishers until one guys stops kicking out. But alas, these physical specimens who are capable of continually kicking of these devastating moves apparently are susceptible to the softest possible groin shots from a grossly out-of-shape senior citizen’s muscle-less arm. Seemed pretty dumb to me.

And, sure, maybe the interference of a minuscule pop star determining the outcome of the “real” main event is no sillier than when Jon Stewart got involved to halt the same record from being broken years ago. However, strangely, even that nonsense was better explained. We get that Travis Scott hit Cody in the ear that one time, but why was he there in the first place? And why does he not like Cody Rhodes? Never explained. Why he got his own music-accompanied entrance here in the middle of the highest profile match of the year will also probably never make any sense.

So, yes, it was dumb as shit. And if I was Triple H I’d certainly also want to be out there in the media the chastising the fans for looking somewhat curiously at my creative choices when all my big matches end with some kind of dopey interference.

Kevin Pantoja: FICTION – I was very tempted to go with FACT but Saturday kept me from doing that. While it was dumb to have Seth/Roman/Punk main event with nothing of real note on the line, the ending to the show itself actually came off very well. The most interesting route was to have Paul Heyman betray both Punk and Roman to side with Seth. It was pulled off in impressive fashion, gave Seth a big Mania main event win (he needed it more than Punk or Roman), and set the table for some interesting storytelling going forward. That’s especially true after seeing Bron Breakker join up with them. That said, the Sunday ending was atrocious. I’m cool with John Cena winning the title but the whole thing simply leading to Travis Scott interfering, with a full entrance, was so stupid. The lack of The Rock hurt and then the cheap belt shot finish was also not good. Just a mess all around and a shitty way to end Cody’s great run.

Statement #2: The Wrestlemania triple threat match between IO SKY, Rhea Ripley and Bianca Belair is one of the best matches you’ve ever seen.

Jake Chambers: FICTION – To me, it was pretty good match. I don’t think I saw anything there that I hadn’t seen before, but it was nice. This is more of a chance for Kevin to expand a little more on this interesting statement he made in his review of Night 2 (which you can read right here). He referred to this quite declaratively as one of the best matches he’s ever seen. I like that. In fact, one of the statements in this year’s Larry Csonka Memorial FoF Tournament finals was wondering if a reviewer is able to see, in the moment, that a match is one of, if not the, best match they’ve ever seen (which you can also read right here). So I am curious to hear more about the process of coming to this conclusion.

Kevin Pantoja: FACT – Anyone who read my review knows this because I gave it the full five stars. I think I even wrote that it’s one of the best matches I’ve ever seen. Throughout wrestling history, I’ve given out fewer than 50 perfect five star ratings and only two for women’s matches (Sasha/Bayley in Brooklyn and Giulia/Syuri at Dream Queendom). What we got from this match was special. These are three of the best women’s wrestlers around and they had a flawless match that packed so much action and personality into the mix from bell to bell. No slow down, a hot crowd, tons of great moments and exchanges, all capped with a fantastic ending. Perfection.

Statement #3: WWE made TNA champion Joe Hendry look like a geek at Wrestlemania in his quick loss to Randy Orton.

Jake Chambers: FACT – I’ve seen both sides of this statement argued convincingly over the past few days, but I’m still going to land on the side of geeked here. Forget that Hendry got beaten in about 3 minutes, or that he’s the champion of a company that expects him to draw PPVs based on having competitive 20+ minute matches – okay, I’m saying it, but don’t count that. Just think about the fact that it’s Randy Orton who beat him. No offense to Orton, but he hasn’t beaten anyone significant in a singles match in a very long time. I mean, he beat Je’Von Evans on the main event of an NXT episode in a match that went 4x as long. In WWE, he’s beating guys like Carmelo Hayes, Ludwig Kaiser and Jimmy Uso. Midcarders. And, again, in much longer matches. Hendry looked like a comedy wrestler who isn’t even remotely competitive with the old-timer who has to struggle to beat midcarders. Geek shit.

Kevin Pantoja: FICTION – I can absolutely see both sides of the argument here. A World Champion losing in 3 minutes is not a great look but the main reason I think it was okay here is that it was TNA. Regardless of how good or bad TNA is doing at any given moment, it’s still TNA. Nobody really takes them seriously. Joe Hendry is very over but it’s not like he’s some unstoppable champion. Like, it would be different if Oba Femi answered the challenge and lost quickly. It was also probably the best option. You don’t want Orton to beat someone making a big return and having him go over an established heel on the roster, like Solo Sikoa, in a few minutes would’ve been more hurtful. Plus, Hendry got Mania merch out of it and the crowd ate it up.

¡SWITCH!

Statement #4: NXT Stand and Deliver should be on the Thursday night before Wrestlemania weekend.

Kevin Pantoja: FACT – There’s already a LOT of wrestling during Mania weekend, even if you’re just watching WWE. This Saturday was rough though, and I say this as someone who enjoyed both shows. I love wrestling but spending basically my entire day from 1 PM through 11 PM watching it isn’t exactly ideal. Just like when a PPV runs 5 or so hours, you need a break and wrestling is typically at its best when it’s not overdone. Moving Stand & Deliver to Thursday not only frees up our days as fans but it also allows Stand & Deliver to breathe on its own. The fact that Stand & Deliver started at like 9:30 AM in Vegas is just nuts.

Jake Chambers: FACT – I don’t think it’s actually possible, but it would be so much better. For every reason Kevin said, and then some. Any marquee aspect of a WM-weekend show for NXT is utterly destroyed when it’s in the morning sandwiched (almost to the hour) between a Smackdown/Hall of Fame broadcast and the WM Saturday pre-show. And it’s a shame, because NXT has better in-ring on average, less commercials, and is just generally more fun than the massively pompous Wrestlemania weekend nonsense. Give it some room, you monsters!

Statement #5: Tetsuya Naito leaving NJPW in 2025 is not a big loss.

Kevin Pantoja: FICTION – This is a tough one. Tetsuya Naito is absolutely a shell of his former self. He should’ve won the top title in 2018 when he was scorching hot and when he won it in 2020, I said he was past his prime and washed. He still gave us some strong performances after that but he was indeed never the same and now he’s at a point where he’s not putting on good matches ever. In WWE or AEW, losing Naito wouldn’t be a big loss. However, this is New Japan we’re talking about. They are as short-staffed as it gets because they severely lack star power. Omega, Ospreay, Okada, White, Ibushi, etc. have all left, Tanahashi is retiring, and only Gabe Kidd and Yota Tsuji feel like they have megastar potential there. This is the bed Gedo made and it’s to the point where losing anyone is a big hit to that roster.

Jake Chambers: FACT – Naito has been really bad for a long time now. Like, unwatchable. Japanese fans don’t want to see him struggle through matches any more than the international fans do. He couldn’t draw against against SANADA in a mediocre main event at the Dome in 2024, and he certainly wasn’t going to draw in a terrible midcard match with Hiromu this year. There’s nothing left to see with Naito, so it’s not a big loss, like Omega, White, Okada and Ospreay in their prime, as Kevin mentioned. Watching Naito against any of this new wave of guys like Tusji or Kidd would have been horrible. It’s better to put them together and let them try to build up their own Naito-like stardom. Naito certainly didn’t get there wrestling hobbled-up old guys. And hey, maybe he can stem-cell himself back into shape or whatever, but in 2025, this is for the best.

Statement #6: WWE events (PLE/PPV) were more enjoyable when ring mats weren’t covered in 9+ ads and the downtime between matches wasn’t twice as long as the actual matches.

Kevin Pantoja: FACT – This one was actually kind of tough for me. On one hand, the ads on the ring don’t really bother me. The show is going to be good or bad regardless of how the mat looks. Whether it’s a Prime bottle, some SNK game, the DraftKings stuff that AEW uses, or a blank mat, none of it impacts the way I enjoy a show. However, I had to go with fact because the other side of side is a major problem. We live in a world where neither major promotion gets PPVs right. AEW does way too many matches, while WWE doesn’t do enough (7-9 is the sweet spot for a PPV) and with WWE doing so few on most major shows, they fill the time with so many commercials and such. I like having time to grab a drink or run to the bathroom but it’s too much. At Mania, there are more matches, yet we still get so much downtime and it’s a problem.

Jake Chambers: FACT – Man, if you don’t notice all those ads on the mat, then you have my envy. I’m kind of glad I’m constantly distracted by those tacky, C-level ads on the once blank mats of the sacred WWE ring. Yes, sacred. I’ve been watching this shit for over 40 years now. It means something to me that they kept it ad-free for so long. That signalled that this was a space for wrestling stories, not cramming shitty products in my face. So after 40 years, if it took less than a year for me to be subconsciously fine with that just obscene amount of advertising, I’d be pretty depressed with myself. And all the power to those who can let it go, I assume they are mentally healthier people than me (and none of us are likely running out to buy any of that crap anyways). But it has absolutely ruined the the visual presentation of WWE. And who knows what this means for the tape library. Where I live, they already have to blur out some of these ads on reply. So, in like 10 years, will they be allowed to still have Prime or some shit on the screen while you’re trying to watch back Rhea vs. Bianca vs. IYO?

Kevin did a good job summarizing the issue of the downtime. And there are stats out there on this, and it’s crazy gross. Basically, the downtime between each match is much, much longer than the actual matches. The sale to Endeavor and the Netflix deal likely killed what was shockingly really a giant independent wrestling company and WWE’s wrestling-first mentality. Even when they wanted us to call it “sports entertainment” it was still never this bad. Now we are literally watching one big commercial with wrestlers in it.

Thank you, as always, to the legendary Kevin Pantoja! You can find his regular reviews of Stardom and major PPV events right here every month.

If you’re still in the Wrestlemania mood, then I highly recommend going back and reading through his recent countdown of the top 50 WM matches of all time!